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Submitted by Bill Ferrer, posted on April 02, 2002




Image Description, by Bill Ferrer



Just wanted to send you guys this image. Its 4 screen shots of a R&D project and will eventually turn into a not yet announced game for the XBOX. The engine uses vertex and pixel shaders to do bump mapping, diffuse and specularity lighting. And has a portal system to do the geometry and light culling. The color of the lights seems to differ from each screen shot because the lights are flickering. Since it is an R&D project, all the art was either made by me (yay for programmer art) or taken from the web. The level was created in 3DS Max. My next step is to create shadows using vertex shaders.

--bill
bferrer


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Archive Notice: This thread is old and no longer active. It is here for reference purposes. This thread was created on an older version of the flipcode forums, before the site closed in 2005. Please keep that in mind as you view this thread, as many of the topics and opinions may be outdated.
 
AticAtac

April 02, 2002, 02:21 PM

Nice screenshots !

XBOX, hmmm ... to me it's (will be) a dead-system.
Let's talk about it in one year ...

 
Anders Pistol

April 02, 2002, 02:24 PM

I know it's programmer art but I can't help feel like the walls are made of plastic... :)
Nice work anyway...

(btw. I got this message when I posted this "A thread by this id already exists! Please report this bug."... figure it's because I was
too slow typing... :)

 
Nick Van Tassell

April 02, 2002, 02:31 PM

I for one like it very much. BTW - how about sharing a little pixel shading knowledge? Very nice work. As for the first comment about the XBOX not being around - have you ever known Microsoft not to dominate?

 
Crisium

April 02, 2002, 02:38 PM

nice pics,.. anyway here is my comment on the xbox ( dead thingy ),.. I don't think it will die,.. I working on a game for the PC, XBOX, and PSX2.

and the PSX2 is putting us in the dark ages... the playstation2 can draw a lot of polygons but it's cpu isn't really designed to do anything at all!?! arggg,.. It took us 1 week to get our game running on the XBOX,... with almost no changes.

I hope the XBOX will live on,.. and hope the playstation series die!

my two cents

 
nosfy

April 02, 2002, 02:38 PM

The XBox is a great system, in fact it is the best but it's not always the best console that won in the console market. The PS2 already sold 28 millions unit, the XBox a mere 2 millions.

Microsoft already know they lost with the XBox (from the discussions I had at the GDC with different people) and are already looking forward to the XBox2. But 2 millions units isn't bad, they have a foot in the door (is that an expression in english?) ...

 
Juggalo

April 02, 2002, 02:39 PM

"have you ever known Microsoft not to dominate?"

Internet runs *NIX

 
nosfy

April 02, 2002, 02:39 PM

Oh! I forgot to comment the IOTD, shame on me! It looks good for programmer art, though I agree the walls have a plastic feel!! : )

 
AticAtac

April 02, 2002, 02:45 PM

Beware of the ".NET" !

 
goltrpoat

April 02, 2002, 02:54 PM

Yeah, out of the consoles I've worked on, Xbox is by far the easiest to code for and the most powerful. PS2 feels like they took really good hardware, teleported back to the 80's and had someone with an engineering degree from the Haiti Polytechnic Institute design the architecture for it.

-poat

 
Ryan J. Parker

April 02, 2002, 02:56 PM

Looks nice. I'd assume the plastic feel is due to the programmers art. Gotta love it :-). I'm sure an artist could make it so that it didn't have that plastic feeling. Just a matter of texturing, I'm sure.

Where's that flame coming from? How is that generated?

 
sheijk

April 02, 2002, 02:59 PM

Well, the walls do look like plastic but somehow I like the feeling of it. Maybe it's the lighting ? It reminds me somehow of a cartoon.

 
goltrpoat

April 02, 2002, 03:10 PM

As for the plastic walls -- you have very pronounced highlights, and the implicit specular from the bumpmap doesn't help.. stone is a very diffuse reflector, since it's grainy and light bounces all over the place from all the little surfaces. Bump up the diffuse and either lower the specular drastically, or disable it entirely and add a gloss map.. should make it look a lot more like stone. Looks good otherwise.

-poat

 
Buster

April 02, 2002, 03:45 PM

Programmer art rules! Down with artists!

 
richard

April 02, 2002, 03:48 PM

We Have The Way In!

 
Olivier Zegdoun

April 02, 2002, 04:14 PM

What do you all have with this "plastic" feeling : he never said it was supposed to be stone ;-)
Actually, he probably even intended to have hightech under ground plastic cave !

Great work, I love it.
Olivier

 
davepermen

April 02, 2002, 04:20 PM

it looks like humus' stuff he wrote for ati radeon and other gpu's.. somehow.. it reminds me at least..

 
Aurora

April 02, 2002, 04:42 PM

XBOX and M$ dominating? Is that anything like M$ starting a self declared smear compaign against UNIX and using FreeBSD based servers for the website instead of Windoze servers? HEE HEE HEE!!!!!!!

 
KieranIsOK

April 02, 2002, 04:57 PM

I don't know if walls are the best use for per-pixel lighting - it seems to me that if you're going to do this stuff, you better have a large number of dynamic point/spot lights in a dark room to make it worth while. Either that, or have destructable scenery, so the dynamic aspect becomes useful.
The reason I say this is because I think static lightmaps look much better than any per-pixel stuff I've seen so far.

Don't get me wrong, it's a really nice bit of per-pixel lighting.

 
Crisium

April 02, 2002, 04:59 PM

TO Aurora:

you have been reading too much april fools stuff on www.slashdot.org
lol!

 
AticAtac

April 02, 2002, 05:27 PM

I didn't want to start a MS vs All War !
The reason i said that XBOX will be dead is not because it is from MS, more cuz of its concept.
Young ppl go for Nintendo64 / GameCube, teenager find PSX1/2 cool, thoses groups don't care about pixel shading and all other technical gimmics, for the remaining group XBOX is interesting, but most of those people do already have a decent PC at home so there is no reason to duplicate it.
From the developer's point of view XBOX is great, most developer's already familar with VC++ and DirectX, so they can fast jump into development, but the customers decide if a console is success and not the developers.

 
Derek Bradley

April 02, 2002, 05:33 PM

Good work with the shading. What caught my attention is that you designed the level in 3DS Max. Did you write the importer yourself? Any chance you could share some knowledge on that?

 
mikie

April 02, 2002, 05:38 PM

It's quite nice to see some multipass stuff - although as people have said - it looks very plastic - bit like 80's pre-rendered cg :)

I think there is a lot more that can be done with this tech - but I havn't seen that much impressive stuff.

I mean check out the ps2 GT3, you only got two passes really.. but they use them well. Nice alpha / specular effect for a shiny sun on the road - then check out the realtime reflections on the cars... take two cars away and they can put in realtime reflections alpha on the road for the wet effect.

I know tons of games are doing this stuff now, but it takes the japanese to show how to do it right.

I agree the ps2 is a bitch to code - but it now has the market,
I expect Xbox to fail... I mean most PC's is gonna out do an xbox no problem by next year.. so all the publishers will make Xbox games availible on PC - becuase they would be crazy not to do that. PC games
don't suit sitting in your living room so... hmhm

Then whats the point in having a limited xbox (it's just a pc after all)

By the time xbox2 comes out ps3 with it's super duper ibm processor comes out (hmmhm ibm.... maybe wanna give bill one up the ass :) )

Mikie

 
Matt P

April 02, 2002, 05:40 PM

what a joke! why?

the XBOX is the most advanced console around.
is backed by microsoft.
has a beautiful api.

why the f*** would it die in a year.
i think you should so your homework.

 
luther2k

April 02, 2002, 05:44 PM

The PS2 is a bit of a beast to code for but it's possible to push it; you haven't seen the best out of that box yet. It lacks some features that should be obvious to any graphics programmer (as far as I'm aware you can't do a single pass rgb modulate with texture on the ps2 which is crazy) but it's still a very flexible, if cumbersome, machine. Nobody has slagged off the gamecube yet and I know nothing about it's architecture so I won't mention a thing.

Tim.

 
Mystic

April 02, 2002, 06:03 PM

Quoted:
I expect Xbox to fail... I mean most PC's is gonna out do an xbox no problem by next year.. so all the publishers will make Xbox games availible on PC - becuase they would be crazy not to do that.

-----

I agree that most PC's will be better than an XBOX next year, heck, my PC already is better... but the PC Game developers have one problem that console programmers do not. Uniformity. Every XBOX will behave the exact same way. PC developers cannot make their games run on a 2GHz GeForce4 platform because they create a limited client base. Not every gamer will have that amount of power, therefore the amount of sales will drop.

When developers create games for a console, they can push it to the max of what it can produce... and expect almost identical frame rates on each system. Also, there is just something about sitting in the livingroom on the couch drinkin a beer and playin a game like Smash Bros with your roommates.

 
shadwstalkr

April 02, 2002, 06:05 PM

Remember Microsoft Bob?

 
Chiguire

April 02, 2002, 06:19 PM

Programmers' Art Kicks Ass!!!

 
Vlion.

April 02, 2002, 06:33 PM

Hmmm.
I agree with the plasticy look.
I think that the straight fps look is kinda boring, personally

Why don`t you jack up the plastic look so that it actually looks like you are in a plastic level ? :-D
Then make the walls meltable so that you can melt thru them with your HyperBigFlameThrower.

Y'know ?
Do a different look.

 
MikeW

April 02, 2002, 06:36 PM

"I mean most PC's is gonna out do an xbox no problem by next year"

Yeah, but then most PC's will also out do all the other consoles as well, so this really isn't a point is it?

Mike.

 
Kurt Miller

April 02, 2002, 06:49 PM

"Yeah, but then most PC's will also out do all the other consoles as well, so this really isn't a point is it? "

I suppose his point might involve the fact that PC and XBox development are supposed to be far more similar than say PC and PS2 development. If a game is published for a console and the PC at a time when the consoles are no longer bleeding edge, one would likely buy the PC version if he has a new machine. If the game is only for the console, he has no choice.

Assuming the above, and assuming that XBox and PC development are as similar as I've heard (haven't seen first-hand), it seems likely more games will be out that are both XBox/PC than games that are both PS2/PC.

 
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