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Submitted by 3TE Team, posted on July 10, 2001




Image Description, by 3TE Team



We have been working very hard for a long time. We have just finished our 2.Tech demo. You can download the demo from our site. We are waiting your critics about it.

In this version:
  • 1) We made many changes and improvements to the training level as you will see.
  • 2) We added Shader technology to our 3D engine. It will be improved in later versions. Some of the features you will see are:
  • Water
  • Transparent surfaces
  • Animated textures
  • Moving, rotating etc. textures
  • Environment mapped surfaces
  • 3) Dont forget to turn your speakers on to hear the background music and sound effects.
  • 4) You can change many features of the 3D engine&Game by using our console.
  • 5) We improved the physics of walking, running, crouching for a better experience.
  • 6) We corrected the collision bug which causes you pass through the solid surfaces.
  • 3TE Team
    Cem UZUNLAR Hakan YÜKSEL
    http://3tegames.com


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    Archive Notice: This thread is old and no longer active. It is here for reference purposes. This thread was created on an older version of the flipcode forums, before the site closed in 2005. Please keep that in mind as you view this thread, as many of the topics and opinions may be outdated.
     
    John van der Burg

    July 11, 2001, 06:44 AM

    Why am I bitching around? I told what I see in the picture, and even said it is looking good, which it does. I think you are the one trying to bitch around. And if you are saying I'm a newbie that means you are not, so please show us all some of your work, maybe we can learn from it...

     
    L.e.Denninger

    July 11, 2001, 07:16 AM

    Yeah, John, you really have to stop bitching around!!! :-)
    Muhahaha :)

     
    John van der Burg

    July 11, 2001, 07:22 AM

    Hey Led :))
    You know I'm a natural born bitch :)

     
    someguy

    July 11, 2001, 09:25 AM

    nice demo =)
    I need to be able to invert the mouse -- it was giving me a headache, hahah.
    Also saw some sparkles along the edges of the tanker truck, and couldn't climb the ladder.

     
    Sylvain Rochette

    July 11, 2001, 10:04 AM

    lol, time for me to bitch, the environment mapping is wrong ;)

     
    Sylvain Rochette

    July 11, 2001, 10:21 AM

    basicly the light is a shader, its a q3 clone engine like mine ;)
    so the light "cone" is face and a shader is applyed on that, its like q3 as well, i am sure the lightmap is correct, the problem is the q3mapeditor that generate this lightmap if you said they are problem with the lightmap ;)

     
    NEGA

    July 11, 2001, 10:26 AM

    Actually what i meant was that with trilinear filtering it does smooth in distance but with noticeable sharp edges, as it is going to a lower mip level the further it gets (this is when you are looking at a plane on an angle). On that note i realized i spelled ansiotropic wrong before, but what i was talking about was the fact that this looked like ansiotropic filtering or a method of bilinear-ansiotropic, what puzzled me is that they would use such texture filtering knowing only newer cards support it in hardware. That is all I wanted to know, what type of filtering are they doing on the texture.

     
    NEGA

    July 11, 2001, 10:55 AM

    well i just tried the demo again and i see you might be right, it probably is just regular trilinear, i forgot that i had RivaTuner and SoftQuatro installed and was forcing ansiotropy in every GL app :o Now that i turned it off it looks like regular trilinear, even with its loss of distance blur artifacts :)

     
    .-wXm-.

    July 11, 2001, 11:20 AM

    define newbie.

    how many years until Im not a newbie ? :).. hehe

     
    Robert Bear

    July 11, 2001, 11:31 AM

    Have yet to see anything "Finished" by John. Pretty engines are easy. Make one with a low enough framerate for AI and Physics though is something totally different.

    Just an additional comment as well. The Facial and Character Animation tools area is getting as crowded as the Engine field. Lotsa companies touting they have teh best lip syncing software.

     
    Pants

    July 11, 2001, 11:35 AM

    Fair comment, but Oxygen3D was beautiful.

     
    David Olsson

    July 11, 2001, 11:45 AM

    "Pretty engines are easy"

    Good for you...

     
    .-wXm-.

    July 11, 2001, 12:43 PM

    took me 1h 20m to download the demo :(..

    one more light thing..
    trucks headlights dont show on the wall.

    the demo looked much better when realy dark (on my sys anyway :) )

    keep on ..

     
    John van der Burg

    July 11, 2001, 02:15 PM

    Robert, dont forget that I was forced to stop with Oxygen3D.
    And next to that, you don't finish an engine like that in a few months if you are working on it in your free time. Also you don't know what I have done in the past. I finished a lot of projects. You only know me from O3D, and since I had to stop with that you now say that you still have to see me finish something. Not really realistic :)

    About the good looking is easy, but you also need AI etc:
    That's partially true. Making things look good can be pretty hard too, and why do you think Oxygen3D was only a nice looking engine, but not usable for other things? You also haven't seen the oxygen3d demos which I never have released to public.
    And all the demos which where released to public did not do any hardware transform and lighting, so CPU power was what you needed. But the TnL versions ran really smooth even on pretty slow machines, and leaved most power to the CPU for AI and things like that.

    And about the character system market. There aren't that many. There is Granny, and probably some others too, but definitely not overcrowded. And it's just one of the components I'm building. So I'm not only focussing on character animation.

    Oh, and if you say that pretty engines are so easy, why haven't I see you write one yet? Where do you base the word 'easy' on? Your experience?

    - John

     
    Robert Bear

    July 11, 2001, 03:53 PM

    I said I haven't seen anything complete, not that you haven't completed anything.

    Ive written 2 engines.. you must agree making em all pretty is easy.. just throw everything you have at it, but try and optimize it and make it work with a large array of hardware, impliment the AI, physics and so on, and that makes it a little tougher.

    I wasn't really meaning to put you down... I must apologize, but alot of people seem to think that a pretty picture makes the engine or the game and that simply isn't true.

    I dont post pics of unfinished work, so if you taunt me about showing pics, you'll have to do without.. sorry..:)

    As for the facial animation and character animation systems... there are a few. LipsInc, LifeFX, Digimations RT Libraries, Expression toolkit, motivate, Nemo, MotionFactory, are a few of them That I can think of off hand.

    Im sure there are quite a few more.

    Robert

     
    Mark Friedenbach

    July 11, 2001, 05:13 PM

    And damn fast.

     
    Arne Rosenfeldt

    July 12, 2001, 06:53 AM

    Download is too slow
    I guess it will not run anyway, since I've got only 16bit color.

    I think trilinear and x*ansiotropic are only buzzwords about hacks
    simply use a fine mipmap level, bilinear interpolate and do
    area weightning

     
    Robert Bear

    July 12, 2001, 11:50 AM

    It wasn't fast.. 45 fps without AI or Physics is fast?.. heh... Dont think so.

     
    Mark Friedenbach

    July 12, 2001, 04:43 PM

    On a Voodoo 2. Now look at the triangle count. 1-2 million, IIRC. That's fast.

     
    John van der Burg

    July 12, 2001, 06:08 PM

    The hardware TnL version of the terrain did up to 17 million triangles per second on geforce 2.
    Robert, even nvidia was impressed by the performance of the engine, they even profiled it in one of their developer papers about optimizing, so I think that means it was fast...

     
    John van der Burg

    July 12, 2001, 06:18 PM

    > Ive written 2 engines.. you must agree making em all pretty is easy..

    It's not just the engine which makes it pretty. It's mostly the art.



    >just throw everything you have at it, but try and optimize it and >make it work with a large array of hardware, impliment the AI, >physics and so on, and that makes it a little tougher.

    Yes, so. That was not a problem with Oxygen3D. It was fast enough.
    Also it's not the above factor which makes writing engines harder. It's the engine design which is hard. Building a simple polygon pusher, which you probably mean with engine is easy. But a complete engine which can actually be used for pretty much all types of games and is flexible and can be continued to use etc, now that's hard.
    Also writing an engine just specific for 1 game is 10x easier as writing one which can be used for for multiple game types.


    >I dont post pics of unfinished work, so if you taunt me about
    >showing pics, you'll have to do without.. sorry..:)

    You just wrote you have written 2 engines. And you are talking about that making an 'engine' which makes things look pretty is easy. So you must have some of these pretty things laying around. Or did they got lost in a harddisk crash?


    >As for the facial animation and character animation systems... there >are a few. LipsInc, LifeFX, Digimations RT Libraries, Expression >toolkit, motivate, Nemo, MotionFactory, are a few of them That I can >think of off hand.

    Sounds like the Lipsinc is already only for lipsyncing, and is it also actually for realtime characters?
    I mean, the character system I am writing is not one to be used in 3D progs like Max or Maya.

    - John

     
    Sylvain Rochette

    July 12, 2001, 06:43 PM

    whta is the secret of the terrain engine? :)

    we want know? and try the demo not the avi one :)

    its possible?

     
    Robert Bear

    July 12, 2001, 09:21 PM

    Ah.. the taunting.

    No, No HD crash... Just can't show pics. Not mine to show. I develop Real time interactive agents that lipsync with text and sound files for a small dev company. Mostly used for AI and multimedia application. Our AI is pretty cool, but our pics so far would be rather un interesting I am afraid.

    LipsInc does more than Max plugins. They do real time lip synching now, although for animated email and video phone usage.

    And um.. I played with some of your demos for Oxygen.. albeit in Feb of last year and fast was not a word I would use to describe it.

    It was quite beautiful, Ill give it that, and told you many times, although you most likely dont recall. Your apparent disregard for potential buyers was rather disheartening, however, I digress.



     
    L.e.Denninger

    July 13, 2001, 05:58 AM

    Yeyaaaahhh...!
    All-out bitch-fight!!!
    Freestyle hardcore full-contact engine-wars!

    Dopedopedope :)

    It's just that I think Robert is getting in deeper and deeper sh*t just to justify a simple remark he made earlier on.. :)

    But who cares. If Robert's happy with what he's made but doesn't want / is unable to show it, so what.

    If John is happy with his code, great.

    I know what John has achieved, that's enough for me.

    Now stop it, you silly boys :)

     
    bluestone

    August 30, 2001, 05:54 PM

    Grrr!

     
    bluestone

    August 30, 2001, 08:57 PM


    'They don't any thing, They don't know how to do. ' the newbies said at their web site. So where is the faithfulness to John Carmack?


     
    L.e.Denninger

    August 31, 2001, 04:43 AM

    OhMyGod, another Carmack-groupie...
    I'm starting to suspect there's an underground gay-movement Carmack-groupie-thing going on..!!!

     
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